On Tuesday, June 30, 2015, Robert Schwebel <r.schwebel@...> wrote:

On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 11:47:45AM -0300, Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri wrote:
> Not yet. We're using an internal one, github issues for the public. Is there a
> good free ML service you recommend?

I don't think so. Let's stay here for the moment :-)

Our first impression when we saw soletta was: wow, they did it right.

And now you are removing autotools and replace that by Kconfig. I don't
think that this is a good idea, especially when things make further
progress and there will be modules with external dependencies.

Our hope is that it will make life easier as we already have modules with external dependencies such as udev and systemd. Tracking that with autotools was becoming more and more of a burden, like conflicts and depends.

--
Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri
--------------------------------------
Mobile: +55 (19) 99225-2202
Contact: http://www.gustavobarbieri.com.br/contact

On Tuesday, June 30, 2015, Robert Schwebel <r.schwebel@...> wrote:

On Tue, Jun 30, 2015 at 05:44:54PM +0200, Robert Schwebel wrote:
> Our first impression when we saw soletta was: wow, they did it right.
> And now you are removing autotools and replace that by Kconfig. I don't
> think that this is a good idea, especially when things make further
> progress and there will be modules with external dependencies.
>
> Are you sure you took care of things like out-of-tree builds and cross
> compilation in a clean environment?
>
> All experience from packaging > 600 tools for ptxdist shows, that any
> package that tries to be smarter than autotools and invent their own
> build system didn't take care of many important things.

rsc@callisto:soletta$ make -j 4 ARCH=arm CROSS_COMPILE=/opt/OSELAS.Toolchain-2014.12.0/arm-cortexa8-linux-gnueabihf/gcc-4.9.2-glibc-2.20-binutils-2.24-kernel-3.16-sanitized/bin/arm-cortexa8-linux-gnueabihf-

...

rsc@callisto:soletta$ file build/soletta_sysroot/usr/bin/sol-fbp-runner
build/soletta_sysroot/usr/bin/sol-fbp-runner: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked, interpreter /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2, for GNU/Linux 2.6.32, BuildID[sha1]=ab8c0ae81e21690d44fe635fc817f906caca899b, not stripped

ARGH!

rsc
--
Pengutronix e.K.                           |                             |
Industrial Linux Solutions                 | http://www.pengutronix.de/  |
Peiner Str. 6-8, 31137 Hildesheim, Germany | Phone: +49-5121-206917-0    |
Amtsgericht Hildesheim, HRA 2686           | Fax:   +49-5121-206917-5555 |
_______________________________________________
Celinux-dev mailing list
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--
Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri
--------------------------------------
Mobile: +55 (19) 99225-2202
Contact: http://www.gustavobarbieri.com.br/contact

On Tue, Jun 30, 2015 at 05:44:54PM +0200, Robert Schwebel wrote:

Our first impression when we saw soletta was: wow, they did it right.
And now you are removing autotools and replace that by Kconfig. I don't
think that this is a good idea, especially when things make further
progress and there will be modules with external dependencies.

Are you sure you took care of things like out-of-tree builds and cross
compilation in a clean environment?

All experience from packaging > 600 tools for ptxdist shows, that any
package that tries to be smarter than autotools and invent their own
build system didn't take care of many important things.

rsc@callisto:soletta$ make -j 4 ARCH=arm CROSS_COMPILE=/opt/OSELAS.Toolchain-2014.12.0/arm-cortexa8-linux-gnueabihf/gcc-4.9.2-glibc-2.20-binutils-2.24-kernel-3.16-sanitized/bin/arm-cortexa8-linux-gnueabihf-

...

rsc@callisto:soletta$ file build/soletta_sysroot/usr/bin/sol-fbp-runner
build/soletta_sysroot/usr/bin/sol-fbp-runner: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked, interpreter /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2, for GNU/Linux 2.6.32, BuildID[sha1]=ab8c0ae81e21690d44fe635fc817f906caca899b, not stripped

ARGH!

rsc
--
Pengutronix e.K. | |
Industrial Linux Solutions | http://www.pengutronix.de/ |
Peiner Str. 6-8, 31137 Hildesheim, Germany | Phone: +49-5121-206917-0 |
Amtsgericht Hildesheim, HRA 2686 | Fax: +49-5121-206917-5555 |

On Fri, Jun 26, 2015 at 11:47:45AM -0300, Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri wrote:

Not yet. We're using an internal one, github issues for the public. Is there a
good free ML service you recommend?

I don't think so. Let's stay here for the moment :-)

Our first impression when we saw soletta was: wow, they did it right.
And now you are removing autotools and replace that by Kconfig. I don't
think that this is a good idea, especially when things make further
progress and there will be modules with external dependencies.

Are you sure you took care of things like out-of-tree builds and cross
compilation in a clean environment?

All experience from packaging > 600 tools for ptxdist shows, that any
package that tries to be smarter than autotools and invent their own
build system didn't take care of many important things.

rsc
--
Pengutronix e.K. | |
Industrial Linux Solutions | http://www.pengutronix.de/ |
Peiner Str. 6-8, 31137 Hildesheim, Germany | Phone: +49-5121-206917-0 |
Amtsgericht Hildesheim, HRA 2686 | Fax: +49-5121-206917-5555 |

Not yet. We're using an internal one, github issues for the public. Is there a good free ML service you recommend?

--
Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri
--------------------------------------
Mobile: +55 (19) 99225-2202
Contact: http://www.gustavobarbieri.com.br/contact

Hi Gustavo,

On Wed, Jun 17, 2015 at 02:15:23PM -0300, Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri wrote:

I'm very glad to announce our project is now published as open source!

https://github.com/solettaproject/soletta

Is there already a mailing list for soletta?

rsc
--
Pengutronix e.K. | |
Industrial Linux Solutions | http://www.pengutronix.de/ |
Peiner Str. 6-8, 31137 Hildesheim, Germany | Phone: +49-5121-206917-0 |
Amtsgericht Hildesheim, HRA 2686 | Fax: +49-5121-206917-5555 |

The Plumbers conference has officially filled up and
closed registration BUT I might be able to get one or
two more people into the conference.

If you think that your presence will provide a positive
contribution to the device tree track, please email me
by Monday afternoon (California time, PDT, UTC-7:00),
with a very brief comment on why your attendance will
be useful.

Regards,

Frank Rowand

Hi all,

I'm very glad to announce our project is now published as open source!

https://github.com/solettaproject/soletta

You're the perfect audience for this project and we hope you get some
time to check it out and test it. We hope it will be useful for people
creating embedded products, not only Linux products but also those in
the micro-controllers as it helps transitioning the knowledge (if not
the code) among different platforms. The main goal of this project is
to aid the developer to create "the device application" for his
product.

It is a first public release and it's far from a stable "1.0" release.
We're sharing the code and want to receive as much feedback as
possible so future development can help more and more developers out
there. So report any problems and ideas, even if you want to bash it,
please share your ideas on how it should be so we can stop being
bashed in the future ;-)

The README is pretty extensive and covers a lot, but what I'd like to
highlight that we make developers lives easier by providing some
uniform way to access basic resources and delivering events. As you
may expect the new wave of developers coming to embedded to implement
IoT are not that experienced and handling multiple OS-specific bits
are error prone and cumbersome, things like getting GPIO events from
interruptions (ISR) or file descriptors (Linux)... This often hurts
portability and we're stuck with a single SoC, board or OS because
porting the software is so painful. Right now we support Linux, RIOT
and there is an ongoing work to support Contiki.

It also helps those that have to support other developers, be a
manufacturer that needs to publish a SDK, be a services company that
helps a customer to create their product or a company that have
independent teams that need to create software components that will be
later joined to create the final product.

The basic programming is done in C and there is a high-level domain
specific language (DSL) to express business logic. The idea behind
this is to be as flexible and efficient as possible while avoiding
errors due asynchronous event programming in C, with all those nasty
callbacks and data passing. The FBP is translated to efficient C
blocks so it can run on very constrained systems. For larger systems
we benefit from FBP by using it as a script language, so one can avoid
build cycles to create the business logic.

This is even more powerful when combined with the "platform conffiles"
so you give your components a name based on purpose and define at
compile or runtime what's the actual implementation, with that one can
use standard keyboard and console to create something on your desktop
(fast), then move it to your real board/OS with minimum effort, just
change the conffile to map the boolean keyboard inputs to your GPIO,
some gtk/slider to your Analog I/O reader and from console to your
servo-motor and you're good to go! All that matters is if the
components have the same ports (names and types).

Last but not least, the license is permissive BSD so it can be
compiled as a static binary or together with the OS for those
micro-controllers.

NOTE: as you may see this from the contributors list the project was
created inside Intel. But it is meant to be a true open source project
without a controlling company. We will be very glad if more
manufacturers join us to help the embedded and IoT ecosystem. Whenever
you want to have your devkit supported, let us know and we will help.

--
Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri
--------------------------------------
Mobile: +55 (19) 99225-2202
Contact: http://www.gustavobarbieri.com.br/contact

Hey everyone,

This is just a quick reminder that June 17 (today) is the deadline for
submitting a proposal for a Embedded Linux Conference Europe.

The conference will be held October 5 - 7 in Dublin, Ireland.

The CFP is at:
http://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/embedded-linux-conference-europe/program/cfp

Submissions will be accepted until midnight Pacific Standard Time, so you've got
some hours left to submit a proposal.

ELCE is always fun and informative. I look forward to seeing you at the event.

Thanks,
-- Tim Bird
CEWG Architecture Group Chair,
Program Committee Chair for ELCE

Dear All,

Please be reminded that next Friday (19th) is the day for next Japan Jamboree.

http://elinux.org/Japan_Technical_Jamboree_53


Best regards,
S. Ueda

--- Japanese ---

各位、

次回の日本テクニカルジャンボリーは5月19日（金）10時から中野サンプラザで開催します。
ちょうどLinuxCon Japanを終えたタイミングです。LinuxConのディスカッションの
レビューや日本語での深掘りをしましょう！LinuxConのプレゼンテーションを【日本語で】
再演なども歓迎します。

現在プレゼンテーションを募集しています。是非ふるって申し出てください。

プレゼンテーション、参加等、すべて無料です。

詳細は下記をごらんください。

http://elinux.org/Japan_Technical_Jamboree_53



上田

--
| TEL: +81-(0)50-3750-3882 FAX: +81-(0)50-3750-6620
| Strategic Alliance Sec. Software Design Technology Promotion Dept.
| Application Platform Design Div. SRDG, Sony Corp.

Hey everyone,

In my previous announcement about the Call for Proposals for
Embedded Linux Conference Europe, I wrote that proposals were due June 7 (today).

This was a typo on my part. They are actually due by midnight (PDT), June 17th.

For detailed information about submitting a proposal, please see:
http://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/embedded-linux-conference-europe/program/cfp

Sorry for the confusion. If you're working on a CFP entry, sorry to make you feel rushed.
I'm excited to see your proposal!
-- Tim

On 5/30/2015 2:36 PM, Frank Rowand wrote:

The "Linux Plumbers Device Tree" track was accepted by the Plumbers
conference.

The above is a pasto, ycch. The track is, of course:

Device Tree Tools, Validation, and Troubleshooting

The DEADLINE for EARLY BIRD REGISTRATION at a reduced price
ends Friday, June 5.

I have a limited number of free registration discounts available for
presenters at the device tree track.

General information about plumbers is at:

http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2015/

Plumbers will be co-located with LinuxCon North America in Seattle
(Plumbers is Aug 19-21, Linuxcon is Aug 17-19).

On Wed Aug 19 there is a shared technical track between the two
conferences. The schedule for that track should be announced very
soon now. Preliminary results are that I will be presenting a talk
on DT debugging in that track.

LinuxCon North America info is at:

http://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/linuxcon-north-america


Hope to see many of you in Seattle.

Regards,

Frank Rowand

I am looking for additional topics to include in the device tree track
at Plumbers 2015.

I am also soliciting people who would like to be session leaders or
scribes.

I have a limited number of free registration discounts available for
session leaders / presenters.

The format at Plumbers is less about presentations and more about
discussions. So enough slides and presentation to set the foundation
of the discussion. Then lots of talking.

The role of the session leader is to
- present a balanced description of the topic / subject area
- ensure multiple view points and alternatives are heard

If you want to help shape the future of device tree, then your
role as a member of the audience is to talk. To provide ideas,
inspiration, your experiences, how the world you live in may be
different than the one that I live in.

The track description is:

The Linux Plumbers 2015 Device Tree Tools, Validation, and
Troubleshooting track focuses on tools (programs and scripts),
techniques, and core support to enable creation of correct device
trees and to support troubleshooting and debugging of incorrect
device trees, drivers, and subsystems.

The tools encompass static (build and pre-boot) and dynamic (boot and
run-time) environments.

Areas of interest include

- inspection
- verification and validation
- troubleshooting
- debugging
- core support for debugging
- unit tests
- designing and implementing drivers for effective debugging
- impact of overlays (boot and run-time updates to the device tree)
- bindings
- documentation

Topics unrelated to the overall track but of current Device Tree
interest may be accepted if there is available time

- ordering of device creation and driver binding

Please contact me if you plan to attend the device tree track. If
you are also attending other tracks, please list those tracks so that
the Plumbers planning committee can try to minimize the schedule
conflicts between tracks.

General information about plumbers is at:

http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2015/

Plumbers will be co-located with LinuxCon North America in Seattle
(Plumbers is Aug 19-21, Linuxcon is Aug 17-19).


Hope to see many of you in Seattle.

Regards,

Frank Rowand

The "Linux Plumbers Device Tree" track was accepted by the Plumbers
conference.

The DEADLINE for EARLY BIRD REGISTRATION at a reduced price
ends Friday, June 5.

I have a limited number of free registration discounts available for
presenters at the device tree track.

General information about plumbers is at:

http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2015/

Plumbers will be co-located with LinuxCon North America in Seattle
(Plumbers is Aug 19-21, Linuxcon is Aug 17-19).

On Wed Aug 19 there is a shared technical track between the two
conferences. The schedule for that track should be announced very
soon now. Preliminary results are that I will be presenting a talk
on DT debugging in that track.

LinuxCon North America info is at:

http://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/linuxcon-north-america


Hope to see many of you in Seattle.

Regards,

Frank Rowand

Dear All,

Please be reminded that the next Japan Jamboree is scheduled on next Friday,
June 19th, at Nakano Sunplaza.

http://elinux.org/Japan_Technical_Jamboree_53

best regards,
S. Ueda

--- Japanese ---

各位、

次回の日本テクニカルジャンボリーは5月19日（金）10時から中野サンプラザで開催します。
ちょうどLinuxCon Japanを終えたタイミングです。LinuxConのディスカッションの
レビューや日本語での深掘りをしましょう！

現在プレゼンテーションを募集しています。是非ふるって申し出てください。

プレゼンテーション、参加等、すべて無料です。

詳細は下記をごらんください。

http://elinux.org/Japan_Technical_Jamboree_53



上田

--
| TEL: +81-(0)50-3750-3882 FAX: +81-(0)50-3750-6620
| Strategic Alliance Sec. Software Design Technology Promotion Dept.
| Application Platform Design Div. SRDG, Sony Corp.

The Boot, Init, and Config microconference is inviting interested parties to comment on proposed topics and show their interest in attending.

Proposed topics are at http://wiki.linuxplumbersconf.org/2015:boot_init_and_config, and include containers, tinification, systemd tuning, k/dbus, early kernel tracing, other embedded/fastboot improvements, and an alternative net boot protocol.

There are likely more proposed topics than will comfortably fit in a 3-hour microconf, please indicate your attendance and interest on the wiki page so that we can plan accordingly.

If you are interested in leading a topic, please let us know!


Sincerely,
John Mehaffey, Kate Stewart, Matthew Wilson

On Mon, May 04, 2015 at 06:20:35PM -0500, Rob Herring wrote:

On Fri, May 1, 2015 at 4:22 PM, Rob Landley <rob@...> wrote:

On 04/11/2015 02:20 PM, Rowand, Frank wrote:

In recent years there have been proposed tools to aid in the creation of valid
device trees and in debugging device tree issues. An example of this is the
various approaches proposed (with source code provided) to validate device tree
source against valid bindings. As of today, device tree related tools,
techniques, and debugging infrastructure have not progressed very far. I have
submitted a device tree related proposal for the Linux Plumbers 2015 conference
to spur action and innovation in such tools, techniques, and debugging
infrastructure.

The current title of the track is "Device Tree Tools, Validation, and
Troubleshooting". The proposal is located at

http://wiki.linuxplumbersconf.org/2015:device_tree_tools_validation_and_trouble_shooting

Want I want to do is:

1) Download an archive of device tree files describing a bunch of
boards. (Both dts and corresponding dtb files, with maybe a .txt telling
me about the board and the -append line qemu needs to give it any
board-specific kernel command line stuff like "console=myserialport".)

The dts half is here[1]. It is a kernel repository automatically
stripped of everything but dts files.

2) Feed one of the dtb files to qemu to instantiate a bunch of devices.

I'd like this too. The QEMU maintainers don't really agree. I think
the ARM virt platform is the wrong way around with QEMU generating the
DT. There was a patch series to allow sysbus devices to be created on
the command line like you can with PCI. This would have allowed a
front end script to generate a QEMU command line from a DT. I'm not
sure if it ever got in.

I suggested something like this several years ago to Anthony Liguori
who didn't much like it. However qemu has changed a fair bit since
then, so it might be worth revisiting.

It's a big job though - lots of integration work with qemu's
configuration core. In particular allowing this without breaking
migrations or the various qapis is not straightforward.

It would lower the bar to adding new platforms to just writing models
for blocks perhaps. I'm not sure there's enough interest. The number
of ARM platforms supported in QEMU is much less than the kernel.

I havea presentation proposal for KVM Forum covering some ideas which
could be at least first steps towards doing this.

--
David Gibson | I'll have my music baroque, and my code
david AT gibson.dropbear.id.au | minimalist, thank you. NOT _the_ _other_
| _way_ _around_!
http://www.ozlabs.org/~dgibson

+Ian

On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 2:34 AM, Geert Uytterhoeven <geert@...> wrote:

Hi Rob

On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 1:20 AM, Rob Herring <robherring2@...> wrote:

On Fri, May 1, 2015 at 4:22 PM, Rob Landley <rob@...> wrote:

On 04/11/2015 02:20 PM, Rowand, Frank wrote:

In recent years there have been proposed tools to aid in the creation of valid
device trees and in debugging device tree issues. An example of this is the
various approaches proposed (with source code provided) to validate device tree
source against valid bindings. As of today, device tree related tools,
techniques, and debugging infrastructure have not progressed very far. I have
submitted a device tree related proposal for the Linux Plumbers 2015 conference
to spur action and innovation in such tools, techniques, and debugging
infrastructure.

The current title of the track is "Device Tree Tools, Validation, and
Troubleshooting". The proposal is located at

http://wiki.linuxplumbersconf.org/2015:device_tree_tools_validation_and_trouble_shooting

Want I want to do is:

1) Download an archive of device tree files describing a bunch of
boards. (Both dts and corresponding dtb files, with maybe a .txt telling
me about the board and the -append line qemu needs to give it any
board-specific kernel command line stuff like "console=myserialport".)

The dts half is here[1]. It is a kernel repository automatically
stripped of everything but dts files.

[1] https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/devicetree/devicetree-rebasing.git/

Great!

While "git log" has the "--nomerges" option, cgit hasn't, making it hard to see
the actual changes through the forest of merges.

Any chance merge commits not causing any changes can be stripped out, too?

That's a question for Ian.

Rob

Hi Rob

On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 1:20 AM, Rob Herring <robherring2@...> wrote:

On Fri, May 1, 2015 at 4:22 PM, Rob Landley <rob@...> wrote:

On 04/11/2015 02:20 PM, Rowand, Frank wrote:

In recent years there have been proposed tools to aid in the creation of valid
device trees and in debugging device tree issues. An example of this is the
various approaches proposed (with source code provided) to validate device tree
source against valid bindings. As of today, device tree related tools,
techniques, and debugging infrastructure have not progressed very far. I have
submitted a device tree related proposal for the Linux Plumbers 2015 conference
to spur action and innovation in such tools, techniques, and debugging
infrastructure.

The current title of the track is "Device Tree Tools, Validation, and
Troubleshooting". The proposal is located at

http://wiki.linuxplumbersconf.org/2015:device_tree_tools_validation_and_trouble_shooting

Want I want to do is:

1) Download an archive of device tree files describing a bunch of
boards. (Both dts and corresponding dtb files, with maybe a .txt telling
me about the board and the -append line qemu needs to give it any
board-specific kernel command line stuff like "console=myserialport".)

The dts half is here[1]. It is a kernel repository automatically
stripped of everything but dts files.

[1] https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/devicetree/devicetree-rebasing.git/

Great!

While "git log" has the "--nomerges" option, cgit hasn't, making it hard to see
the actual changes through the forest of merges.

Any chance merge commits not causing any changes can be stripped out, too?

Thanks!

Gr{oetje,eeting}s,

Geert

--
Geert Uytterhoeven -- There's lots of Linux beyond ia32 -- geert@...

In personal conversations with technical people, I call myself a hacker. But
when I'm talking to journalists I just say "programmer" or something like that.
-- Linus Torvalds

On Fri, May 1, 2015 at 4:22 PM, Rob Landley <rob@...> wrote:

On 04/11/2015 02:20 PM, Rowand, Frank wrote:

In recent years there have been proposed tools to aid in the creation of valid
device trees and in debugging device tree issues. An example of this is the
various approaches proposed (with source code provided) to validate device tree
source against valid bindings. As of today, device tree related tools,
techniques, and debugging infrastructure have not progressed very far. I have
submitted a device tree related proposal for the Linux Plumbers 2015 conference
to spur action and innovation in such tools, techniques, and debugging
infrastructure.

The current title of the track is "Device Tree Tools, Validation, and
Troubleshooting". The proposal is located at

http://wiki.linuxplumbersconf.org/2015:device_tree_tools_validation_and_trouble_shooting

Want I want to do is:

1) Download an archive of device tree files describing a bunch of
boards. (Both dts and corresponding dtb files, with maybe a .txt telling
me about the board and the -append line qemu needs to give it any
board-specific kernel command line stuff like "console=myserialport".)

The dts half is here[1]. It is a kernel repository automatically
stripped of everything but dts files.

2) Feed one of the dtb files to qemu to instantiate a bunch of devices.

I'd like this too. The QEMU maintainers don't really agree. I think
the ARM virt platform is the wrong way around with QEMU generating the
DT. There was a patch series to allow sysbus devices to be created on
the command line like you can with PCI. This would have allowed a
front end script to generate a QEMU command line from a DT. I'm not
sure if it ever got in.

It would lower the bar to adding new platforms to just writing models
for blocks perhaps. I'm not sure there's enough interest. The number
of ARM platforms supported in QEMU is much less than the kernel.

Rob

[1] https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/devicetree/devicetree-rebasing.git/